Lots of good stuff coming
DB
***. . .Click here to read more!*** Don't forget to read the ***aBoUt Me*** and Welcome Post 07/05, both located on the sidebar to your right!
(Some days it feels like it!) Chronicles the exploits of a brazen, young donkey in the midwest who opened a strip club 10 yrs ago, built it into a sucessful business, grew bored, and found poker! Follow Donkey Bait on his quest to become a poker superstar; beat by beat, drink by drink, and blow by blow. E-mail donkeybait@earthlink.net
A friend e-mailed me this the other day and I thought it would be nice to post so others may comment on it. Paint is referring to a quate from Barry Greensteins book, Ace on the River. "for me limit poker is like watching paint dry. Daniel, thanks for your thoughts, I'll add a comment below. DB
I had an interesting conversation with my father regarding limit vs. no-limit hold’em. The conversation crossed my mind after I read your favorite quote from Barry’s book. I too once thought playing limit poker was like watching paint dry. Hold’em is the defiantly Cadillac of poker. But now after playing poker for two years consistently, both my father and I believe we were better off having never owned a Cadillac because we would have lost it in a bad beat of no-limit poker.
My father and I were discussing how no-limit hold’em has left us with more COSTLY bad beats than we wish to talk about. Yesterday at a popular online poker site (which I no longer trust, lets talk about that someday) my full boat, jack’s over 8’s, was beat by a straight flush made on the river. I lost my entire bank which was doubled from what I began with. At the same time I was taking my beat my father experienced his own. He began with Ace Jack and flopped top pair (Jack, 9, 3). He raised $100 in to the $75 pot. After a long pause the loan man across the table called his bet. A Queen hits on Fourth St. Cautious my father bets $50 and receives a call from the man. The river hits an ace giving my father two pair. He pushes all-in and is called immediately with Ace Queen. $300 + lost on one hand of poker.
When bad beats happen in No-limit poker you lose everything. These beats happen to us enough times that over the long haul we have not made much money. My father claims he is down overall. In a limit games neither my father nor I have ever lost our ENTIRE bank. When we win limit poker we have always made just as much as we have in winning no-limit. I believe if you want to risk less and win more play limit.
Go to any online poker site and look at the pot averages for no-limit and limit games. Which would you think has the larger average? If you guessed limit your right. As I write this paper there are two $100/$200 limit games going on at the internet site I play on. The average pots for the tables are $707 and $1057. There are 13 $2000 no-limit buy in games. The highest and lowest averages in these games are $384 and $181. Since I like winning bigger pots I think I am switching primarily to limit games.
My father and I agreed at the end of our conversation to begin playing more limit poker than no-limit poker. Sure we still love no-limit and the huge amount of excitement the game brings. But we are more interested in huge pots. To avoid going cold turkey I will take some of my winnings from limit games and play in a no-limit game hoping that one day my bad beat is high enough to win the bad beat pot.
Donkey Bait's Reply:
Poker can be an unforgiving mistress. 3 recent beats at the boat in the 2-5 NL game account for slightly more than I was ahead there. All 3 beats occured when I was holding AA. First bad beat I limp, late position raises to 25 small blind calls I reraise to 90, late fold, small blind donkey calls. Flop is QT6 rainbow. Small blind bets out about 50, I push all in he calls, showing AT. Donkey says he thought I had KK's and that he could catch an A. What he caught was runner, runner KJ for a straight! I lose $500.
Hand #2 I'm in middle position and raise to 20 w/ AA and get 1 early position caller. Flop comes 5,rag,rag, 2 suited and early position guy bets out, I raise, he reraises, oh shit now what, I think and put him on an overpair and push all in, and run squarely into his set of fives (thank god he didn't yell "Presto"). When the money went in he had the best of it, but was still an ugly hand. I lose $425
Beat #3 Actually occurs about 15 minutes after hand #2. I rebuy for $300 and find American Airlines in late middle position. Yippe Kiyay right, Poker gods trying to make things right from that last ugly debacle. Unfortunately is was not meant to be. Under the gun +1 raises to 20, its folded to me, I would normally raise in this spot, but noticed that 2 players to my left were telegraphing that they were going to fold so I just call and it is folded around. 2 of us see a 6 high flop. Early position guy bets out about 40, I raise to 100, he thinks and calls. I put him on an overpair. Turn a 6. Surely he wouldn't have raised preflop w/any hand that has a 6 in it! He checks I push in he thinks and relatively quickly calls showing 67 suited. Oh well. I lost $300 and decide that is enough for a while!
Beats are brutal in poker and more so in No LImit. You can read on and on about how it's good that all of these donkey's are out there making these mistakes, you should win more in the long run, they say. Well it sure sux in the short run! It's kind of a 1 sided deal and here is why, If you play good solid poker, you are less likely to put your money in the pot when you don't have the best of it. Drawing, chasing Donkeys are more likely to put a beat on us than the other way around, because we would usually have folded If the situation wasn't in our favor.
If you prefer NL poker to Limit poker but want to cut down on the severity of the beats, have you considered playing in Sit-n-go tourneys. These are 1 table tournaments and you can control your risk based upon how much you want to pay for a sit-n-go. Say you buy into a $50 sit-n-go the most you can lose is that $50. Just a thought.
For me, I find it very frustrating in limit poker when I can't protect my hand w/ a pot sized bet. There are many situations in limit where you may have the best hand, bet it out, and the caller still has the correct odds to call and draw to his hand.
Only risking %15 of your poker bank roll in one session of NL is supposed to protect the winning NL player from most bad runs. We all adhere to that right! lol. If only it was that simple.
Earlier this year I decided to goat to the boats in St. Louis w/ a $300 bankroll and try and build it up from there. I built it up to about $600 only to lost it all in a $1500 pot. Once again I had AA, my opponet had KK and it went in preflop. He flopped his set, I turned the nut flush draw and his set held up! Ouch. Then I decided to play limit poker, so I started w/ another $300 bankroll and started at the bottom planning to work my way up in limits. It took about 10 sessions, moving from 3/6 quickly to 5/10 and I built my bankroll up to over $1200 and decided to take a stab at the 20/40 limit game. I scored a $950 win in my first session. It was shortly after this that the Booneville boat opened and I started frequenting them because they are so much closer.
My brick and mortar results so far this year certainly support your argument, but I am still drawn to NL. If I could just figure out how to play those aces! Lately, I feel that my game has improved a great deal, and I am going to continue to play NL, I feel that my overlay is greater there, and I can't lose on aces everytime! Thanks, Daniel, for taking the time to share your thoughts, I'll talk to you soon.
DB
. . .
Dance Name: Reeva
Sign: Scorpio
Age: 23
Height: 5'6"
Weight: (including silicone): 122 lbs.
Personality: Outgoing and adventuresome. She has a winning personality and a smile that is irresistable!
Favorite Position: Reeva says she likes it from behind, starting slow and building to a fury.
Turn Ons: Threesomes w/ other couples
Turn Offs: She says she is sure she has some but can't think of any right now!
I apologize for the photo quality, Donkeybait is on the lookout for a new digital camera!
Where to begin; what I meant in the Title bar is that I played with the best and held my own, and also that Harrahs just sux, can't really say that enough let me reiterate, Harrahs pretty much sux. They bought the Horseshoe last year and along w/ that came the rights to the WSOP. Along with the crazy high cash bar, Players who bought into the events were given a voucher for $10 off of the buffet! How cheap is that! What they don't tell you is that your voucher expires at midnight the day your event ends. Unbelieveable. If you were at the Superbowl, and say the ball is tipped in the air and lands in your lap would you be suprised if it wasn't a regulation (wilson I believe) leather football? What if it was a cheap plastic nurf ball? What would you think? Well the WSOP had the largest payout of any world championship sporting event in the history of the universe and the cards they used were the cheapest, flimsiest, paper cards I have ever seen in my life. Even the print on the faces of the cards is weak. like the printer was almost out of ink! I actually stole the Ace of spades from a box of used up cards to bring home and show my friends. When they finish with these decks they don't need to cut them or drill them they are so flimsy they just fold the cards in half, it easily leaves a permanent crease. The same WSOP 05 hat that cost 22.00 in New Orleans cost $29 here! And to top it all off, they cut the rounds from 1 hr, to 40 mins in my event just so they could "speed it along". That more or less really made the event more of a crapshoot, I totally believe that I had a great shot of making the money, If I could have had around 15 more hands a level, maybe I would have cought some cards. How lame. Basically at Harrah's owned properties everything cost a little more and you get a little less.
and got it back up to 1k. Shortly there after my table broke and I got moved to the same table as Cindy Violette. If you haven't heard of Cindy Violette click on her name it is a link to her bio. She is a real big time pro, one of the best male or female! Also she isn't just a tourney player but an ultra high stakes cash game player. After I busted her, she bought into a High limit triple draw game for 40K! Cindy has also made 2 tables at this years WSOP, the $5000 pot limit, and the $2000 NL. This table was quite a bit more intimidating than my first one and I decided to check them out and play tight for a bit. About 2o mins into it I played at and pulled down a decent pot on the flop, then the next hand I took down the blinds, by this time I had a much better read on the table, plus some new found confidence. One interesting hand, it's folded to the cutoff, (thats 1 seat before the button) and cindy violette limps. small blind folds I'm in the BB and rap the table. Flop came rags, she bet I folded. Pretty boring huh, except that preflop I thought her limp was strange, and I studied her and felt like she had a monster. After I folded she showed AA. She was a little disgusted, cause she had them 3 times already and didn't win any big pots. Anyways I'm at about T1400 and limp in middle position w/ 44. Flop comes j83 2 clubs. 3 players saw the flop and it goes check, I check Cindy checks. Turn a beautiful 4! check, I check, Cindy Violetette goes all in, early limper calls, and I go all in for about 2oo more! Cindy shows a pair of 8's and early donkey had top pair all along and I tripled up! Guys I knocked out Cindy Violette, one of the top 3 female players in the wolrd out of a WSOP event! All in all I played great, my cards really sucked, was up and down, got moved to a table where to my left a guy had a monster stack, the blinds kept comming at me, the deck kept dodging me and I made my stand on the button w/ a9s. It was folded to me, I raised it up, BB put me all in, I called, bb had aq and held up. Finished right about 150th out of 758 players, about 75 out of the money. Sorry I can't leave more now but will check in later.